tag:blogger.com,1999:blog-7378568575885387942.post7082644082924345548..comments2024-02-18T18:59:06.164+00:00Comments on Econosophy and other musings: "Free gold" — Shiny, New and Good?Tobyhttp://www.blogger.com/profile/16258136994278139356noreply@blogger.comBlogger6125tag:blogger.com,1999:blog-7378568575885387942.post-90462131654516948032010-11-10T06:14:16.119+00:002010-11-10T06:14:16.119+00:00"I am speaking, of course, about the conditio..."I am speaking, of course, about the condition whereby the primary international medium of exchange is also the international unit of account, as well as the planet's store of value."<br /><br />Untenable yes, but the cure, in my view, is not to seek another (whether new or old) store of value other than those stores that do the actual job. Here we differ fundamentally, you and I. My position is; monetary wealth is an illusion to be penetrated and unlearned. Gold is an obstacle to that objective.<br /><br />"In the meantime, your world view, which, as I understand it, seems to feature imminent global ecosystem collapse"<br /><br />If by "imminent" you mean next week, or next year, then that is not my position. But if you mean imminent in terms of decades, perhaps a century, then yes, that's where I think we are at, not from my own field work, but from books I have read. And yet, more importantly, collapse is happening <i>right now</i>, because the depth and breadth of change needed to restore the planet's ecosystems will take decades to affect. <br /><br />Like a car falling from a cliff, the impact might be a way off and as yet 'not happening.' Impact is, though, inescapable. Some scientists say ecosystem degradation is so advanced we no longer have a chance; it's already in free fall, others that there is still hope. I'm with the latter group, not because I know what I'm talking about, but because, with 2 young daughters, I prefer to live in hope. I would otherwise not be writing this blog.Tobyhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/16258136994278139356noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-7378568575885387942.post-6029782038047954542010-11-09T17:26:38.479+00:002010-11-09T17:26:38.479+00:00I'm moved, Toby, that out of respect for me yo...I'm moved, Toby, that out of respect for me you took the time to explore Freegold. And while I think your assertion that FOFOA is less than straightforward in describing Freegold is fair, for my own part I feel I have a decent understanding of what Freegold is as a result of time spent on the blog. <br /><br />As for the idea that all does not seem to be worked out with respect to a monetary system under Freegold, I have a few comments: <br /><br />First, no system of economic organization has ever managed to overcome various flaws and internal contradictions that have, in time, ultimately sundered the system. <br />The tendency towards corruption, sometimes unbridled corruption, is, as you note, ever present, and while physical gold is substantially less easy to, for example, counterfeit, it is hardly immune to jiggery pokery. <br /><br />And this brings me to my final comment on Freegold as it relates to the claims of its proponents. I am not aware, other than the quote you provided in your post, that, in the main, Freegold proponents feel Freegold is an economic cure all. <br /><br />Their claim about the utility of Freegold is quite specific as it relates to the primary ill that they feel besets the global monetary system. I am speaking, of course, about the condition whereby the primary international medium of exchange is also the international unit of account, as well as the planet's store of value. This is, simply put, an untenable state of affairs. <br /><br />In the meantime, your world view, which, as I understand it, seems to feature imminent global ecosystem collapse, does not allow for, or perhaps better stated, transcends anything so mundane as an epochal swing back to a monetary system that recognizes and acknowledges gold in a qualitatively different way than at present.<br /><br />As for the prospect of missing out on a fortune, while we can not be sure what the future holds in store as regards gold being revalued at a much higher level-in whatever currencies exist in future- the record, so far, given the appreciation in precious metals over the past decade, shows that many already have.Edwardohttps://www.blogger.com/profile/03613197383283896190noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-7378568575885387942.post-30716451756036511212010-11-09T16:16:45.993+00:002010-11-09T16:16:45.993+00:00This comment has been removed by the author.Edwardohttps://www.blogger.com/profile/03613197383283896190noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-7378568575885387942.post-18554879781581449402010-11-09T15:22:24.933+00:002010-11-09T15:22:24.933+00:00Thanks guys.
"It seems to be a gold money sy...Thanks guys.<br /><br />"It seems to be a gold money system for savings and a fiat money system for transactions day to day,"<br /><br />That's how it reads to me. It differs from the gold standard in that 'money' is not tied to gold, gold is priced 'freely' by the market so as, I guess, to expose the 'real' value of the paper stuff. That does not strike me as a system. The only diff is 'gold' prices are not manipulated. But how is that to be achieved? <br /><br />These calls for the 'real' free market, for 'true' capitalism, are folly in my opinion. In the 1600s some Italian trader/financier wrote a book detailing all the scams of that time. Markets and manipulation go hand in hand. The goal is to win, to accrue monetary wealth, so it can't be free since the big players--the winners--will always have a huge advantage over the small guys. The myth of the medieval farmers' market is just that, a myth. Even there I'm sure there were scams and corruptions.<br /><br />I could write more, but my mind is made up. The world I'm battling for is diametrically opposed to those wanting to make a killing out of the current breakdown. If that means I lose out on a golden opportunity to become rich, then so be it.Tobyhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/16258136994278139356noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-7378568575885387942.post-66190522945278570902010-11-09T14:57:23.579+00:002010-11-09T14:57:23.579+00:00Well done Toby
I've been at FOFOA as well th...Well done Toby<br /><br /><br />I've been at FOFOA as well the last few days. Have made many comments there. I'm sure they are talking behind my back as that "crazy fuckin' socialist MMT guy GREG!!"<br /><br />I share your frustration with figuring it out. It seems in my discussions with FOFOA that he is pursuing a third way solution, a King Solomon divides the baby answer. I appreciate that because I think we are locked into many improper and incomplete dichotomies. What I cant do is get a picture of how it works and what are the tradeoffs. There must be some tradeoffs, it is not "THE" answer that will make everyone happy. That doesnt exist.<br /><br />It seems to be a gold money system for savings and a fiat money system for transactions day to day, but I cant get a clear delineation of HOW it would supposedly work. But I'm still trying. There are some very thoughtful commenters there so I'm gonna stay awhile. Bill Mitchell and Warren Mosler explain MMT so well it seems ridiculously obvious and I bang my head wondering how ANYONE couldnt figure that out!<br /><br />Keep up the good workGreghttps://www.blogger.com/profile/03139782404004492965noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-7378568575885387942.post-79004262514116529832010-11-08T19:48:33.271+00:002010-11-08T19:48:33.271+00:00Nice article Toby.Nice article Toby.Anonymoushttps://www.blogger.com/profile/13850588586412355359noreply@blogger.com